Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 17:22:20 EST
Subject: Fwd: [FRCtech2002] Digest Number 13


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There are 25 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

      1. Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
      2. Slots/Chutes in Field
           From: "vicepro" <gonzalesvicente@otc.army.mil>
      3. Re: Is there a tank tred limit
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
      4. Re: Atwood Mobile Motor
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
      5. How long does it take
           From: Carl Hansen <CARL_HANSEN@IEEE.ORG>
      6. Re: Slots/Chutes in Field
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
      7. Re: fiberglas
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
      8. "50-yd line"
           From: "wasssoap" <kenny.ardizzone@motorola.com>
      9. Re: motor addition
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     10. Re: Small Parts Items from other suppliers?
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     11. Re: Three Questions
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     12. Re: Making wheels have better traction
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     13. Re: bumper dimensions question
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     14. Re: Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!
           From: taylor boi <taylorboi2@yahoo.com>
     15. Back to Small Part problems
           From: "bcitwest" <jfgrater@grater.com>
     16. Small Parts
           From: "St_Claire" <st_claire@yahoo.com>
     17. Re: Digest Number 10
           From: lewis.sussman@dartmouth.edu
     18. lobbing soccer balls back to the students allowed?
           From: "jpltaftfirst" <vanelli@grover.jpl.nasa.gov>
     19. Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     20. Re: Acceptable chain types
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     21. Re: lobbing soccer balls back to the students allowed?
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     22. Re: Robot Components
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     23. Re: allowed materials
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     24. Re: Atwood Mobile Motor
           From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
     25. Wheel Hubs
           From: "robodude399" <robodude03@hotmail.com>


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Message: 1
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:47:24 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!

> I see questions in the posting that ask if you can use four drive 
> motors and your answer was yes.  Since there are not four of any   
> one kind of motor, this causes some confusion!  Can we use four    
> Atwood motors to drive the robot?
A) No, you cannot use 4 Atwood motors because only 2 were provided.  
You can use all of the motors in the 2002 Kit of Parts in the 
quantity supplied to perform any function you wish.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 2
   Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2002 02:31:58 -0000
   From: "vicepro" <gonzalesvicente@otc.army.mil>
Subject: Slots/Chutes in Field

Similar to the field walls used last year, will there be cut-outs or 
square slots at the base of the walls this year?

If so will these openings be large enough to allow soccer balls 
through?

Can a team member stick their hand through the openings to grab balls 
hurdled by a bot?


Thanks,




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Message: 3
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:57:21 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Is there a tank tred limit

> Is there a limit to how much or how long tank treds can be?

As per Team update #2 
Chain/Belt and length any amount.
FIRST-t 




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Message: 4
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:55:03 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Atwood Mobile Motor

> Update #1 does not provide outline drawings and power curves for the
> Atwood Mobile motor.  Will these be provided?  Soon?


If you look at the bottom left corner on the spec provided in Team 
Update #1 you will see a box that says "Performance Curves"
A larger copy will be provided in the next team update.  
FIRST-t




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Message: 5
   Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2002 23:48:32 -0500
   From: Carl Hansen <CARL_HANSEN@IEEE.ORG>
Subject: How long does it take

Hi, Team 87.

How does it take to post a mesage to the Board.  We posted a question last
week and still don't see:

1.  The question.

2.  Anything close to the question.

This leaves us wondering if we are able to post questions to the board at
all.  Could someone please p-mail me so that I know I am able to actually
get to the right place?


The original question was:

In years past, there have been limitation on what can and can not be used
as an Axel.  Are there currently any limitation on what material or pieces
purchased from Small Parts can be used for an axel?


TIA

Carl Hansen
Team 87
Rancocas Valley Regional HS

In a perfect world without walls or fences........
  .....................why would we need Windows or Gates?

         ........... Only a True Jedi Master can touch the dark side
                                          ............ and remain untainted!

[This message contained attachments]



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Message: 6
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 18:56:24 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Slots/Chutes in Field

> Similar to the field walls used last year, will there be cut-outs 
or square slots at the base of the walls this year?
A) No.  The holes to which you are referring will be covered over 
with a piece of diamond plate.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 7
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:03:47 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: fiberglas

> Does the fiberglas listed in materials have to be rigid?
A) No.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 8
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 16:44:44 -0000
   From: "wasssoap" <kenny.ardizzone@motorola.com>
Subject: "50-yd line"

Will there now be a line of tape on the carpet to divide the entire 
field into halves?  Perhaps a dotted line or construction-zone tape 
or tape of a different color? 






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Message: 9
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:08:08 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: motor addition

> Can we add 2 drill motors to the robot?
A) You can use any or all of the motors that were in the 2002 Kit of 
Parts.  The Kit had 3 drill motors so that is all that can be used.  
FIRSTsnow




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Message: 10
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:27:56 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Small Parts Items from other suppliers?

> 1.) Are we allowed to get an item that is listed in the Small Parts 
> catalog from any other supplier if it is completely identical?
A) No... unless Small Parts is out of stock then you can go 
elsewhere.  FIRSTsnow

> 2.) Are we allowed to get an item that is on the Small Parts 
catalog from another supplier/from another company with the exact 
same specifications for the item?
A) No.  Same answer as question #1.  FIRSTsnow
 
> 3.) Are we allowed to get parts that are on the additional hardware 
> list donated?
A) Yes.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 11
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:44:45 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Three Questions

> 1. Can a robot deliberately interact with the bottom of the upper 
> plywood platform of the goal (as long as it does not cause damage)?
A) No.  FIRSTsnow
 
> 2. How many pneumatic cylinders are we allowed to use on our robot?
A) 7 (see answer #106).  FIRSTsnow

> 3. Is it acceptable to design our robot to contact the lower 
portion of the field barrier for a fixed distance (again assuming no 
damage)?
A) No.  See GM18.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 12
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:45:44 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Making wheels have better traction

> Our Team wants to know if you are allowed to add small studs with 
> rounded tips to the wheel?
> 
> Lets say, under normal operation these studs do not damage the 
carpet 
> but if your robot is hit or dragged by another robot damage does 
> occur.  Is this damage considered to be made by your robot or the 
> robot that dragged you?

Modifying the wheels is allowed, however, if you are dragged across 
the field by another machine and the carpet is damaged it will be 
considered your robots fault and you will have to make any changes 
necessary.  
FIRST-t




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Message: 13
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:49:52 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: bumper dimensions question

> The rules state that bumpers may extend 4" in addition to the 
maximum dimensions of the robot.  Is this 4" total added to the 
dimensions or is it 4" added to each side of the robot?
A) See answer #94.  FIRSTsnow




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Message: 14
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 11:41:30 -0800 (PST)
   From: taylor boi <taylorboi2@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!


 Prior answer indicated 3 were provided clarify please .Tay
  frcengineers <frcengineers@yahoo.com> wrote: > I see questions in the posting that ask if you can use four drive 
> motors and your answer was yes.  Since there are not four of any   
> one kind of motor, this causes some confusion!  Can we use four    
> Atwood motors to drive the robot?
A) No, you cannot use 4 Atwood motors because only 2 were provided.  
You can use all of the motors in the 2002 Kit of Parts in the 
quantity supplied to perform any function you wish.  FIRSTsnow



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Message: 15
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:39:42 -0000
   From: "bcitwest" <jfgrater@grater.com>
Subject: Back to Small Part problems

Small Parts has items back-ordered for 1 1/2 to 2 weeks, can we 
obtain these parts somewhere else ?




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Message: 16
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:39:27 -0000
   From: "St_Claire" <st_claire@yahoo.com>
Subject: Small Parts

Do teams recieve a credit at small parts, or only the 25% percent 
discount?

Thanks.




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Message: 17
   Date: 16 Jan 2002 14:34:23 EST
   From: lewis.sussman@dartmouth.edu
Subject: Re: Digest Number 10

>From Lewis Sussman, Team 95


Regarding use of "old" parts, i.e. parts that came with old kits such as motors, cylinders, etc, NOT parts that were machined or manufactured by your team in a previous year, in message # 85,  you respond to the following question:

> Stating M15. " All mechanisms on the robot should be 
> fabricated/assembled by the 2002 team after the start of the Kick-
 off 
> Workshop. Mechanisms may not be reused from previous year's robots."
> My question is;" Can we use parts from last year's kit such as: 
> Air tanks, motors, or Seat Motor Assembly?

A) Only if it's in this year's kit and it's the same exact part.
Remember that the seat positioning unit are not a part of this year's 
kit. Also don't forget you can not exceed the quantities per part in 
this year's Kit of Part list in Team Update #1.

Later, you respond to a similar question:

>Can we use parts from last year's kit such as air tanks, motors or 
seat motor assembly?
A) No... but many of the individual parts this year are the same as 
last year. Do not exceed the specified quantities and absolutely no 
mechanisms from prior years are to be used this year. FIRSTsnow

These answers seem to be contradictory.  Can you state clearly, are you allowed to use unaltered parts from a previous kit, or that have been previously purchased before this year's kickoff?

Another question:  I have sent two messages in the last two weeks, both of which were never posted or answered.  Is the lead time very long, are they getting lost, or do you just not have the answers yet?  A crucial rules question that others have asked as well concerns damage to the carpet.  In a situation where one robot pushes another and the carpet under the robot being pushed is damaged, who gets the penalty, the pusher or the pushee?



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Message: 18
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 19:28:52 -0000
   From: "jpltaftfirst" <vanelli@grover.jpl.nasa.gov>
Subject: lobbing soccer balls back to the students allowed?

Rule S6 states that soccer balls are the only projectiles that the
robot can launch.

- May the robot launch soccer balls over the wall between the field
and the alliance station to team members (so they can then throw them
into the goal) ?

- If the robot is allowed to lift or lob balls into the alliance
station, and subsequently a ball rolls out of the alliance station,
may the student retrieve it?  Or is it considered
lost-and-gone-forever...





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Message: 19
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:04:23 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 4 Atwood motors to clarify once and for all..!!!!!

>  Prior answer indicated 3 were provided clarify please!
A) I cannot find where 3 were mentioned but there are 2 Atwood 
(Chiaphua) motors in the Kit.  FIRSTsnow

>   frcengineers <frcengineers@y...> wrote: > I see questions in the 
posting that ask if you can use four drive 
> > motors and your answer was yes.  Since there are not four of 
any   
> > one kind of motor, this causes some confusion!  Can we use 
four    
> > Atwood motors to drive the robot?
> A) No, you cannot use 4 Atwood motors because only 2 were 
provided.  
> You can use all of the motors in the 2002 Kit of Parts in the 
> quantity supplied to perform any function you wish.  FIRSTsnow
> 
> 
> 
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Message: 20
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:11:39 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Acceptable chain types

> Is the Rex Nord thermoplastic chain acceptable to use on our robot. 
> We are thinking about using rex nord chains #843 or #6938.

As per the Updated Additional Hardware Listing in team update #2
Chain/Belt and size any amount.
FIRST-t




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Message: 21
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:12:05 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: lobbing soccer balls back to the students allowed?

> Rule S6 states that soccer balls are the only projectiles that the
> robot can launch.  May the robot launch soccer balls over the wall 
between the field and the alliance station to team members (so they 
can then throw them into the goal)?
A) Yes.  FIRSTsnow
>
> If the robot is allowed to lift or lob balls into the alliance
> station and, subsequently, a ball rolls out of the alliance station,
> may the student retrieve it or is it considered > lost-and-gone-   
> forever.
A) Lost and gone until the next match when the field is reset.  
FIRSTsnow




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Message: 22
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:19:47 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Robot Components

> Please tell me if the following statement is true or false:

> Anything found in the Small Parts catalog, regardless of whether or 
> not it is on the Additional Parts List, may be used as a 
functioning component of the robot.
A) True.  FIRSTsnow





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Message: 23
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:22:07 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: allowed materials

> Would a material similar to that of the bottom a car matt be allowed 
> for friction?

ONLY if it can be found on the additional hardware list.
FIRST-t  




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Message: 24
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:24:42 -0000
   From: "frcengineers" <frcengineers@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Atwood Mobile Motor

> Is there a shaft coupler to the Atwood Mobile motor spline?  I need 
> to extend the spline so I can mount two sprockets on it.
> 
> Also, I could not find the specs on this motor.

Spec can be found in team update #1.
No shaft coupler is known as this motor is made to specificaly mate 
with the gear provided.
FIRST-t  




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Message: 25
   Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 20:25:45 -0000
   From: "robodude399" <robodude03@hotmail.com>
Subject: Wheel Hubs

Can we order the wheel hub assembly?




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